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	<title>Comments on: Blame perversity for the worst kind of climate change denial</title>
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	<link>http://bravenewclimate.com/2008/12/31/blame-perversity-for-the-worst-kind-of-climate-change-denial/</link>
	<description>Getting to grips with the brave new world of future climate and energy - notes from a Promethean environmentalist</description>
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		<title>By: Steven Earl Salmony</title>
		<link>http://bravenewclimate.com/2008/12/31/blame-perversity-for-the-worst-kind-of-climate-change-denial/#comment-5178</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Steven Earl Salmony]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 20 Jan 2009 15:10:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://bravenewclimate.com/?p=815#comment-5178</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[[&lt;em&gt;Deleted: Off topic and I note the exact same wording of this comment has been posted on other sites.&lt;/em&gt;]]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[<em>Deleted: Off topic and I note the exact same wording of this comment has been posted on other sites.</em>]</p>
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		<title>By: Steven Earl Salmony</title>
		<link>http://bravenewclimate.com/2008/12/31/blame-perversity-for-the-worst-kind-of-climate-change-denial/#comment-5129</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Steven Earl Salmony]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 19 Jan 2009 14:06:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://bravenewclimate.com/?p=815#comment-5129</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[[&lt;em&gt;Deleted: Off topic and I note the exact same wording of this comment has been posted on other sites.&lt;/em&gt;]]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[<em>Deleted: Off topic and I note the exact same wording of this comment has been posted on other sites.</em>]</p>
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		<title>By: Peter Wood</title>
		<link>http://bravenewclimate.com/2008/12/31/blame-perversity-for-the-worst-kind-of-climate-change-denial/#comment-4398</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Peter Wood]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 02 Jan 2009 05:03:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://bravenewclimate.com/?p=815#comment-4398</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[A big factor in why the Australian governments targets were not good enough was related to the issue of rent seeking. Polluting industries were doing what they could to alter climate change policy so that the burden of emissions reduction was shifted away from them. The most successful rent seeking tactic is lying, distorting the truth, and saying a lot of nonsense. The main nonsense is that emissions reductions will be incredibly costly, and so costly that industries will close down (possibly heading overseas), jobs will be lost, and so on. Rent seekers did a huge amount of work sending out this message to the public and to government. I think that one thing that the climate change movement needs to focus on more is countering this message.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A big factor in why the Australian governments targets were not good enough was related to the issue of rent seeking. Polluting industries were doing what they could to alter climate change policy so that the burden of emissions reduction was shifted away from them. The most successful rent seeking tactic is lying, distorting the truth, and saying a lot of nonsense. The main nonsense is that emissions reductions will be incredibly costly, and so costly that industries will close down (possibly heading overseas), jobs will be lost, and so on. Rent seekers did a huge amount of work sending out this message to the public and to government. I think that one thing that the climate change movement needs to focus on more is countering this message.</p>
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		<title>By: Hank Roberts</title>
		<link>http://bravenewclimate.com/2008/12/31/blame-perversity-for-the-worst-kind-of-climate-change-denial/#comment-4350</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Hank Roberts]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 Jan 2009 01:55:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://bravenewclimate.com/?p=815#comment-4350</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[http://krugman.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/12/31/looking-for-a-word/

He begins:

&quot;Unusually, I’m having a vocabulary problem. There has to be some word for the kind of person who considers his mild discomfort the equivalent of torture, crippling injury, or death for other people. But I can’t think of it. ....&quot;]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="http://krugman.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/12/31/looking-for-a-word/" rel="nofollow">http://krugman.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/12/31/looking-for-a-word/</a></p>
<p>He begins:</p>
<p>&#8220;Unusually, I’m having a vocabulary problem. There has to be some word for the kind of person who considers his mild discomfort the equivalent of torture, crippling injury, or death for other people. But I can’t think of it. &#8230;.&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: Steven Earl Salmony</title>
		<link>http://bravenewclimate.com/2008/12/31/blame-perversity-for-the-worst-kind-of-climate-change-denial/#comment-4337</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Steven Earl Salmony]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 31 Dec 2008 15:44:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://bravenewclimate.com/?p=815#comment-4337</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Why not lay blame where it belongs: at the feet of the economic powerbrokers who organize and manage a colossal pyramid scheme, a modern representation of the ancient Tower of Babel? Is the denial of anthropogenic global warming and the human-driven destabilization of Earth&#039;s climate not primarily for the purpose of preserving the selfish material interests of a few wealthy and powerful people, and their minions?

Let&#039;s look a bit more closely at the scandulous &#039;business&#039; of Bernie Madoff, confidence games, Ponzi schemes and other financial vehicles for funneling, accumulating and concentrating billions of dollars in unearned wealth into the hands of a tiny minority of people who comprise the top of the global economy.

There are many minions of the wealthy and their bought-and-paid-for politicians who &quot;spread the word&quot; of these schemes. Con men operate pyramid schemes. They assure &quot;plausible deniability&quot; and &quot;legal cover&quot; for all that is said and done. 

Only a telling of the truth about what they are doing is forbidden. That is the one and only thing that is verboten. Do not break their vow of silence by telling what is true about the perpetration of the schemes {ie, the only games in town, so they say}, because the &quot;houses of cards&quot; out of which a modern Tower of Babel is constructed immediately is exposed as fraudulent and patently unsustainable.  These pyramidal constructions can withstand any force except that which is presented by speaking out loudly and clearly about what is happening in these enterprises.  As soon as light of what is true was shed on Bernie&#039;s scheme, the house of cards he had constructed fell.

Bernard Madoff may be the first of my &quot;Not So GREAT GREED GRAB Generation&#039;s&quot; kingpins to find that his &quot;house of cards&quot; has collapsed; but I dare say, Bernie will not be the last. There are other kingpins and many too many minions ready, willing and able to play along in what looks like the greatest self-enrichment scam in human history.

Why not say that greed is not good? Why not assign value to personal honesty, accountability and transparency?

Steven Earl Salmony
AWAREness Campaign on The Human Population,
established 2001
http://sustainabilityscience.org/content.html?contentid=1176]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Why not lay blame where it belongs: at the feet of the economic powerbrokers who organize and manage a colossal pyramid scheme, a modern representation of the ancient Tower of Babel? Is the denial of anthropogenic global warming and the human-driven destabilization of Earth&#8217;s climate not primarily for the purpose of preserving the selfish material interests of a few wealthy and powerful people, and their minions?</p>
<p>Let&#8217;s look a bit more closely at the scandulous &#8216;business&#8217; of Bernie Madoff, confidence games, Ponzi schemes and other financial vehicles for funneling, accumulating and concentrating billions of dollars in unearned wealth into the hands of a tiny minority of people who comprise the top of the global economy.</p>
<p>There are many minions of the wealthy and their bought-and-paid-for politicians who &#8220;spread the word&#8221; of these schemes. Con men operate pyramid schemes. They assure &#8220;plausible deniability&#8221; and &#8220;legal cover&#8221; for all that is said and done. </p>
<p>Only a telling of the truth about what they are doing is forbidden. That is the one and only thing that is verboten. Do not break their vow of silence by telling what is true about the perpetration of the schemes {ie, the only games in town, so they say}, because the &#8220;houses of cards&#8221; out of which a modern Tower of Babel is constructed immediately is exposed as fraudulent and patently unsustainable.  These pyramidal constructions can withstand any force except that which is presented by speaking out loudly and clearly about what is happening in these enterprises.  As soon as light of what is true was shed on Bernie&#8217;s scheme, the house of cards he had constructed fell.</p>
<p>Bernard Madoff may be the first of my &#8220;Not So GREAT GREED GRAB Generation&#8217;s&#8221; kingpins to find that his &#8220;house of cards&#8221; has collapsed; but I dare say, Bernie will not be the last. There are other kingpins and many too many minions ready, willing and able to play along in what looks like the greatest self-enrichment scam in human history.</p>
<p>Why not say that greed is not good? Why not assign value to personal honesty, accountability and transparency?</p>
<p>Steven Earl Salmony<br />
AWAREness Campaign on The Human Population,<br />
established 2001<br />
<a href="http://sustainabilityscience.org/content.html?contentid=1176" rel="nofollow">http://sustainabilityscience.org/content.html?contentid=1176</a></p>
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		<title>By: Geoff Russell</title>
		<link>http://bravenewclimate.com/2008/12/31/blame-perversity-for-the-worst-kind-of-climate-change-denial/#comment-4324</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Geoff Russell]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 31 Dec 2008 09:57:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://bravenewclimate.com/?p=815#comment-4324</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Belief is really a 2D surface. Most academics at, for example, Adelaide
University, believe, sincerely that global warming is a serious
global problem. But is there a glut of
bicycles at the bike racks? Is there a crush of people saying: &quot;No, I won&#039;t
fly to that conference in Europe&quot;? Has there been a mass conversion 
to low/no animal product diets?  This is sincere belief with little 
action. It&#039;s a long way from skepticism, but an equally long way
from the kind of belief that implies a change in behaviour. 

A person in pharmacy or history or any other disciple, is far more 
concerned with their special problems and expects somebody else to 
deal with climate change.  This is how it normally works. I don&#039;t think
about pharmaceuticals, that&#039;s their job. I just expect the drugs to
work, just like I expect Barry to solve this climate change problem,
that&#039;s his job.   :)

Happy new year Barry -- great blog.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Belief is really a 2D surface. Most academics at, for example, Adelaide<br />
University, believe, sincerely that global warming is a serious<br />
global problem. But is there a glut of<br />
bicycles at the bike racks? Is there a crush of people saying: &#8220;No, I won&#8217;t<br />
fly to that conference in Europe&#8221;? Has there been a mass conversion<br />
to low/no animal product diets?  This is sincere belief with little<br />
action. It&#8217;s a long way from skepticism, but an equally long way<br />
from the kind of belief that implies a change in behaviour. </p>
<p>A person in pharmacy or history or any other disciple, is far more<br />
concerned with their special problems and expects somebody else to<br />
deal with climate change.  This is how it normally works. I don&#8217;t think<br />
about pharmaceuticals, that&#8217;s their job. I just expect the drugs to<br />
work, just like I expect Barry to solve this climate change problem,<br />
that&#8217;s his job.   :)</p>
<p>Happy new year Barry &#8212; great blog.</p>
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		<title>By: Nick</title>
		<link>http://bravenewclimate.com/2008/12/31/blame-perversity-for-the-worst-kind-of-climate-change-denial/#comment-4312</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Nick]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 31 Dec 2008 01:49:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://bravenewclimate.com/?p=815#comment-4312</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&quot;Believing while denying&quot; is an inevitable phase on the journey to truth, that&#039;s the best I can spin it! The visceral preoccupations of now compete with the decreasingly hypothetical, ever-nearer future. The cranks lack the self-awareness to even enter this state of mind,let alone move ahead to actively reducing consumption; no doubt a product of a society where the means of support arrives in pipes,cables,containers and bags, and where an education in the earth sciences is deemed optional,and the planet is a mysterious place from which status objects are won. And it&#039;s no wonder that the MSM is obsessed with the economy; it&#039;s the crude social mechanism which must be re-jigged to acknowledge ecological realities....so let&#039;s jig away in 2009. Many thanks for your dynamic blogging, Barry.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Believing while denying&#8221; is an inevitable phase on the journey to truth, that&#8217;s the best I can spin it! The visceral preoccupations of now compete with the decreasingly hypothetical, ever-nearer future. The cranks lack the self-awareness to even enter this state of mind,let alone move ahead to actively reducing consumption; no doubt a product of a society where the means of support arrives in pipes,cables,containers and bags, and where an education in the earth sciences is deemed optional,and the planet is a mysterious place from which status objects are won. And it&#8217;s no wonder that the MSM is obsessed with the economy; it&#8217;s the crude social mechanism which must be re-jigged to acknowledge ecological realities&#8230;.so let&#8217;s jig away in 2009. Many thanks for your dynamic blogging, Barry.</p>
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		<title>By: Gareth</title>
		<link>http://bravenewclimate.com/2008/12/31/blame-perversity-for-the-worst-kind-of-climate-change-denial/#comment-4303</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Gareth]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 30 Dec 2008 20:46:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://bravenewclimate.com/?p=815#comment-4303</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Sceptics - or as I prefer to call them, cranks - are a something more than a silly diversion. Politicians and business leaders don&#039;t want to be seen to be radical (on this issue, at least), so having a bunch of cranks out there proclaiming that global warming doesn&#039;t exist provides a spurious &quot;balance&quot; to the huge weight of evidence that it&#039;s real and happening now. This leads to the adoption of a spurious &quot;middle ground&quot; where climate change is real and our fault, but perhaps not as bad as those extremist/alarmist scientists are suggesting.

Scientists themselves buy in to this framing of the issue, as Hansen has noted in the past, by trying to avoid being seen to be &quot;alarmist&quot;, even when the results of their work are genuinely alarming.

Cranks don&#039;t have to make sense. Their continued noisy existence is enough to achieve the desired effect - and the careful orchestration of the crank chorus by the likes of the Heartland Institute should tell us all we need to know about whose desires are being fulfilled.

I don&#039;t mean to imply in this that the institutional blindness you describe doesn&#039;t exist, just that the cranks provide a context within which it can seem rational.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sceptics &#8211; or as I prefer to call them, cranks &#8211; are a something more than a silly diversion. Politicians and business leaders don&#8217;t want to be seen to be radical (on this issue, at least), so having a bunch of cranks out there proclaiming that global warming doesn&#8217;t exist provides a spurious &#8220;balance&#8221; to the huge weight of evidence that it&#8217;s real and happening now. This leads to the adoption of a spurious &#8220;middle ground&#8221; where climate change is real and our fault, but perhaps not as bad as those extremist/alarmist scientists are suggesting.</p>
<p>Scientists themselves buy in to this framing of the issue, as Hansen has noted in the past, by trying to avoid being seen to be &#8220;alarmist&#8221;, even when the results of their work are genuinely alarming.</p>
<p>Cranks don&#8217;t have to make sense. Their continued noisy existence is enough to achieve the desired effect &#8211; and the careful orchestration of the crank chorus by the likes of the Heartland Institute should tell us all we need to know about whose desires are being fulfilled.</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t mean to imply in this that the institutional blindness you describe doesn&#8217;t exist, just that the cranks provide a context within which it can seem rational.</p>
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